obama's speech - Teh Forum

<body> <div id="header"> <span class="left"> <span class="back"><a href="lthread_list.php?webtag=DEFAULT"><span class="image mobile_back" title="Back"></span></a></span> <span class="image mobile_logo" title="Beehive Forum Logo"></span> </span> <ul> <li> <a class="reply_all" href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41193.0&return_msg=41193.20"> <span class="image mobile_reply_all"></span><span class="text">Reply to All</span> </a> </li> <li> <a class="navigation" href="#"> <span class="image mobile_navigation"></span><span class="text">Show messages</span> </a> </li> <li> <a class="main" href="#"><span class="image mobile_menu" title="Menu"></span> </a> </li> </ul> </div> <div class="menu main"> <ul> <li><a href="lthread_list.php?webtag=DEFAULT">Messages</a></li> <li><a href="lpm.php?webtag=DEFAULT">Inbox</a></li> <li><a href="lsearch.php?webtag=DEFAULT">Search</a></li> <li><a href="llogon.php?webtag=DEFAULT">Login</a></li> </ul> </div> <div class="menu navigation"><a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.1">1–10</a><a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.11">11–20</a><a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.21">21–30</a><a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.31">31–40</a>…<a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.81">81–88</a></div> <div id="page_content"> <h3 class="thread_title"><a href="index.php?webtag=DEFAULT&amp;msg=41193.20">obama's speech</a> </h3> <div id="messages" data-navigation="41193_20_88_10"> <a name="a41193_20"></a><div class="message" id="message_41193_20"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: 99% of gargoyles look like (MR_BASTARD)<span class="message_time">13 Sep 2014 17:21</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: fixrman <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 14 Sep 2014 13:59"></span></span> <span class="message_count">20 of 88</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.20">41193.20</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.19">41193.19</a></div> <div class="message_body"> <div class="quotetext"><b>quote:</b> <a href="messages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.19">fixrman</a></div> <div class="quote">Are you including the population of Merry Olde England in that assessment, or is that something you reserve solely for Americans. Actually, Canada and Britain are considered more democratic than the U.S. is. We vote for a president, but a president is not necessarily elected by popular vote, it is decided by Electoral votes. So a guy like obama, who exploited inherent weaknesses in that system of election by concentrating on population centers to gain electoral votes, gets in power.<br /> <div class="quotetext"><strong>Quote:</strong> </div> <div class="quote">the position of most powerful leader in the West was donated to a buffoon</div> <p>As opposed to the buffoon in there now? Was there ever a POTUS you liked?</p> </div> <p>I was particularly thinking of the population of Merrie Olde England (and its nearest neighbours).<br /><br /> POTUS that I liked? I guess Abe was pretty decent. Clinton...but she's not been elected yet.</p> </div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41193.20&return_msg=41193.20" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41193.20"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41193_21"></a><div class="message" id="message_41193_21"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: Drew (X3N0PH0N)<span class="message_time">13 Sep 2014 20:36</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: fixrman <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 14 Sep 2014 13:59"></span></span> <span class="message_count">21 of 88</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.21">41193.21</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.17">41193.17</a></div> <div class="message_body"> The crazy structure of law enforcement is a political issue as is the militarisation of the police. But I was more referring to the ineptitude with which the political class responded to the situation (or in Obama's case singularly failed to, which is fucking <em>weird</em> for a second term president for whom the whole Ferguson thing must touch on issues of importance).<br /><br /> Prison stuff: You're not a direct democracy of course, but you are a representative democracy, same as we are (we're a constitutional monarchy).<br /><br /> Numbers <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarceration_rate#United_States">here</a>. The US figure (707 per 100k) excludes lots of classes of prisoners which are included in other countries' figures and still manages to dwarf the numbers for any comparable country. England and Wales are on 148. The highest western democracy with no special circumstances besides the US (based on a quick scan, I may have missed sommat) is New Zealand on 183.<br /><br /> The causes of this problem are of course manifold. A few obvious ones being disenfrranchisement of minorities (it's not just blacks that are overrepresented in prisons, also hispanics), gun laws, popularity of 'tough on crime' stances with electorates, the fact that minorities are less likely to vote.<br /><br /> But I think the real clincher is the fact that many of your prisons are run as businesses and those businesses are owned, ultimately, by politicians, lawmakers and those with lobbying influence.<br /><br /> It's a humanitarian crime that dwarfs anything China, Russia or NK are up to and yet it goes largely uncommented upon.</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41193.21&return_msg=41193.20" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41193.21"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41193_22"></a><div class="message" id="message_41193_22"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: 99% of gargoyles look like (MR_BASTARD)<span class="message_time">13 Sep 2014 21:30</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: Drew (X3N0PH0N) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 13 Sep 2014 22:19"></span></span> <span class="message_count">22 of 88</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.22">41193.22</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.20#a41193_21" target="_self">41193.21</a></div> <div class="message_body"> <div class="quotetext"><b>quote:</b> <a href="messages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.21">X3N0PH0N</a></div> <div class="quote">the fact that minorities are less likely to vote.</div> <p>What's stopping them?</p> </div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41193.22&return_msg=41193.20" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41193.22"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41193_23"></a><div class="message" id="message_41193_23"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: ANT_THOMAS<span class="message_time">13 Sep 2014 21:31</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: 99% of gargoyles look like (MR_BASTARD) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 14 Sep 2014 07:54"></span></span> <span class="message_count">23 of 88</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.23">41193.23</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.20#a41193_22" target="_self">41193.22</a></div> <div class="message_body"> They're all in prison? <br /> <br /> But seriously, nothing will be stopping them. Just I imagine feeling disenfranchised is the reason they don't. </div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41193.23&return_msg=41193.20" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41193.23"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41193_24"></a><div class="message" id="message_41193_24"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: Drew (X3N0PH0N)<span class="message_time">13 Sep 2014 22:20</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: 99% of gargoyles look like (MR_BASTARD) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 14 Sep 2014 07:54"></span></span> <span class="message_count">24 of 88</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.24">41193.24</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.20#a41193_22" target="_self">41193.22</a></div> <div class="message_body"> What Ant said.</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41193.24&return_msg=41193.20" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41193.24"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41193_25"></a><div class="message" id="message_41193_25"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: 99% of gargoyles look like (MR_BASTARD)<span class="message_time">14 Sep 2014 07:55</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: ANT_THOMAS <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 14 Sep 2014 08:12"></span></span> <span class="message_count">25 of 88</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.25">41193.25</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.20#a41193_23" target="_self">41193.23</a></div> <div class="message_body"> Fair point. But the can hardly complain when they're not represented, can they?</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41193.25&return_msg=41193.20" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41193.25"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41193_26"></a><div class="message" id="message_41193_26"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: ANT_THOMAS<span class="message_time">14 Sep 2014 08:15</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: 99% of gargoyles look like (MR_BASTARD) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 14 Sep 2014 08:37"></span></span> <span class="message_count">26 of 88</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.26">41193.26</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.20#a41193_25" target="_self">41193.25</a></div> <div class="message_body"> I guess it then comes down to saying that none of the options represent them. <br /> <br /> Which sends you to the next option, stand yourself then? I can only imagine that is incredibly difficult (read: impossible) because of the prohibitively high cost of entering US politics. </div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41193.26&return_msg=41193.20" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41193.26"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41193_27"></a><div class="message" id="message_41193_27"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: fixrman<span class="message_time">14 Sep 2014 14:08</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: 99% of gargoyles look like (MR_BASTARD) <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 14 Sep 2014 14:49"></span></span> <span class="message_count">27 of 88</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.27">41193.27</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.20#a41193_20" target="_self">41193.20</a></div> <div class="message_body"> <div class="quotetext"><strong>Quote:</strong> </div> <div class="quote">Clinton...but she's not been elected yet.</div> <p>Now that's comedy. Basically the fact you like Clinton shows that you are not well informed at all about American politics. We already had one failed experiment, the America people don't need to suffer under another one. The PIAPS is probably more corrupt than Johnson was and is morally bankrupt. Perhaps look into her past before you make a judgement on her. The fact that she is female should not <span style="color:#696969;">make a difference</span><span style="color:#808080;"> </span>to you, at least in the sense of making historical strides. A female president is not necessarily a Bad Thing for America, except for that female. I am not sure she even is a woman.<br /> </p> </div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41193.27&return_msg=41193.20" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41193.27"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41193_28"></a><div class="message" id="message_41193_28"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: CHYRON (DSMITHHFX)<span class="message_time">14 Sep 2014 14:22</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: fixrman <span><span class="image post_read" title="Read: 14 Sep 2014 18:08"></span></span> <span class="message_count">28 of 88</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.28">41193.28</a> In reply to <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.20#a41193_27" target="_self">41193.27</a></div> <div class="message_body"> Hillary Clinton's a nasty piece of work, always has been.</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41193.28&return_msg=41193.20" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41193.28"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div><a name="a41193_29"></a><div class="message" id="message_41193_29"> <div class="message_header"> <div class="message_from"> From: cynicoid<span class="message_time">14 Sep 2014 16:34</span> <div class="clearer"></div> </div><div class="message_to">To: ALL<span class="message_count">29 of 88</span><div class="clearer"></div> </div> </div> <div class="message_links"> <a href="lmessages.php?webtag=DEFAULT&msg=41193.29">41193.29</a></div> <div class="message_body"> I just go along with the expert, unbiased views of Rupert Murdoch and Channel 4 comedians.</div> <div class="message_footer"> <div class="message_footer_links"><a href="lpost.php?webtag=DEFAULT&reply_to=41193.29&return_msg=41193.20" class="reply"><span class="image post"></span>Reply</a></div> <div class="message_vote_form" data-msg="41193.29"> <span class="rating">0/0</span> <span class="image vote vote_down vote_down_off" title="Vote Down"></span> <span class="image vote vote_up vote_up_off" title="Vote Up"></span> </div> </div> </div></div> <div class="message_page_footer"> <ul> <li class="right_col"><form accept-charset="utf-8" method="get" action="lmessages.php" target="_self"><input type="hidden" name="webtag" id="webtag" class="bhinputtext" value="DEFAULT" dir="ltr" /><input type="hidden" name="msg" id="msg" class="bhinputtext" value="41193.30" dir="ltr" /><input type="submit" name="submit" id="keep_reading" value="Keep reading…" class="button" /></form></li> </ul> </div> </div> </body>